141: Lorraine K. Lee: From Invisible to Unforgettable: Lorraine on Presence, Speaking, and Saying Yes

You know that person on LinkedIn who makes you stop scrolling — in a good way? That’s Lorraine K. Lee.

In this electric episode, Lorraine joins me to talk about:

• How she landed her first job in Silicon Valley (spoiler: it involved a barbecue)
• Why she ditched traditional journalism for tech—and never looked back
• The real reason she wasn’t getting promoted at LinkedIn (and what changed)
• Getting laid off... then launching a thriving speaking business
• Her path to becoming a LinkedIn Top Voice, keynote speaker, and now bestselling author of Unforgettable Presence

We also unpack what “presence” really means (hint: it’s more than just executive presence), and why your LinkedIn profile might be doing you more harm than good.

If you’ve ever felt like your hard work is going unnoticed, or that public speaking isn’t for “people like you,” this one’s for you.

Plug in, take notes—and prepare to be inspired.

Follow Lorraine on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lorraineklee/

Get the book: https://lorraineklee.com/unforgettable-presence/

-------------------------------------------

Liked this episode? A few things:

1. Share the podcast with three of your closest friends! And please leave a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify here (tap on the three-dot menu under the cover art of the podcast) , as it would mean a lot to me and hopefully help others discover it.

2. You will love my emails called Charge-Up! They're no fluff no spam, where I share my favourite career insights from movies, TV shows, news and my own personal experiences, that I don't share anywhere else. Make sure you sign up here!
https://www.superchargeyourself.com/newsletter

3. Come hang out with me LIVE on LinkedIn and Youtube every Friday at 2 pm CET where I answer your questions and often bring in fab guests:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sonalbahl/
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/SuperChargeYourself

4. Share your favourite takeaways and tag me on your Instagram and LinkedIn.

Transcript

Hey, welcome back, welcome back. 

My guest today is someone who's probably made you pause mid scroll on LinkedIn in the best possible way. So, Lorraine K. Le is a keynote speaker, LinkedIn learning instructor, and upcoming best selling authority of this book called Unforgettable Presence that I have no doubt will be on many, many bookshelves very soon. So we'll talk more about that in a minute. But, I do want to talk a little bit more about her. So Lorraine actually helps high potential professionals to get seen and heard without being over the top. I love that. I've been following her work for a while, so when her team reached out I, I was genuinely excited to have her on the show. Lorraine, very warm welcome to How I Got Hired. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited. Me too, me too. 

So let's get started. Lorraine. I kind of like to start at the beginning to sort of see where things were when we were in our planning phase. Particularly when we are younger, you know, in our like teens and twenties and where we are today. It's always fun to sort of look back on this period. So in your case, you studied journalism at Northwestern and then started out in editorial roles at LinkedIn and later SlideShare. So I want to hear more about. So firstly, the podcast is called How I Got Hired. I love hearing how people got those juicy first roles. So let's talk about that. And then I also want to know about how those early career experiences shaped your voice. And part three, because I'm greedy. I'm asking, did you ever imagine that these roles in your early years would lead to where you are today? All right, hopefully I'll remember all parts of the question. Let me dive in. So, yes, I studied journalism at Northwestern and pretty early on I knew that I didn't want to do traditional journalism. I, knew the skills were important, but traditional journalism is very hard. It was very unsteady at the time, even more so now. And I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do. But at the time that I entered the workforce, tech was becoming a big thing and I started reading all these articles about how lucrative Silicon Valley is and how much opportunity there was. And I had reached out to a former, manager at one of my internships and she was also working in Silicon Valley in Palo Alto. And she mentioned she was working at this startup. She was like, it's amazing, like, you know, great pay, great benefits, like you have to come here, like, I'll be able to get you the job. And so initially I wanted to move back to la, which is where I grew up. But I decided, okay, let me try living in the bay, moving in the bay. And if I don't like it, I'm close enough, I can go back home. And so I started off my career at a, messaging startup in a marketing function and I loved it. And I was like, wow, okay, this is, there's appetite for marketing, for editorial, for content within tech companies. So after about two years there I moved over to SlideShare, which was a LinkedIn company at the time. And LinkedIn had always been a dream company of mine. And the way I got hired, I applied online and then I ended up at this barbecue and this guy was there, Brian. And we were talking and I found out he worked at LinkedIn. And I was like, oh my gosh, Brian, like LinkedIn has been my dream company since college, like I really want to work here. And he goes, he opens up his phone and of course he finds me on LinkedIn. And thankfully, since I was obsessed with LinkedIn, like my profile, you know, there wasn't really content at the time, but my profile was very complete, like all optimized and all that. And he was super impressed and he sent my profile along and tried to fast track me. And what I didn't know was that Brian, and he didn't know this either at the time, but Brian would eventually become the chief of staff to the CEO. So he was like a very, you know, big name at LinkedIn and so he was so kind of him to help me and pass my name along but essentially got fast tracked because they were already on third round interviews at that point. And then I got the job at SlideShare, eventually moved over to LinkedIn proper. So I was there for six years as a founding editor, really formative experience. And then Prezi afterwards as its first editor. Super interesting. I just want to unpack a couple of things because I think they're very, very important and I don't want them to get overlooked. The first thing is you decided to study something. However, at some point you realized, you know what, actually I don't want to do this. So you still managed to, you completed the degree and you graduated. And I think at the time when you were doing this there was so much change in the journalism field with you know, legacy and you know, classic sort of newspaper magazine world to online and streaming and digital and all of that. So that takes courage because a lot of people will say sunk cost, it's done doesn't matter. Let's milk it. The second thing was the power of internships and networking during internships. And I love this because you're not the first person to share this. And a lot of people think, no, who are. Who am I to ask? And what are they going to think? And you have nothing to lose, actually, at that stage. And she remembered you and she liked you, and she's like, come, I'll get you a job. So that was good because you weren't going into San Francisco. Like, what am I going to do? I'm going to do some waitressing while I figure things out. No thanks to that connection, you had a soft landing. And the third thing is randomly coming across someone in a barbecue who works at your dream company. This will freeze so many of us because the ego is front and center. What are you gonna say? You're gonna look, like, foolish, you know, so forget it. And you decided to get over yourself. So what would you say to someone who. Maybe we'll see someone at, like, a social event, Lorraine. And they want to talk to that person. Maybe they've been following them on social media, or maybe they heard that this person works at my company, that I'm super interested in, my dream company, whatever. But there is a lot of fear holding them back. So I just want to stay here for a second, ask you about this, because this is very real. Or in those instances, if you don't do anything, the answer is for sure going to be no. If you ask, it might be no, but it might also be yes. And I think when you approach with respect, when you're polite, when you show authenticity, like that goes a long way, people appreciate that. I think most people want to help other people. So if you can find that connection, and, you know, it's not just asking for something, but maybe you can offer something in return. Learn a little bit more about the person. How can you be of help now or later? I think that's a really helpful way to approach a conversation. Very, very true. And I think, I would even go so far as to say it might be more risky not to ask Because we always assume it's a risk. What if he says no like you said? The answer is no, regardless, if you don't ask. So what have you got to lose? Right? So love that. And, when you look back at this period, Lorraine, how did this experience at these two companies, how do you think it shaped your voice and, you know, being yourself, standing up for yourself, all of that. I wish I had stood up for myself a little bit more. So these first, you know, the first part of my career was a lot of trial and error. I was someone who felt very comfortable with my head down in execution mode, doing what I was told and executing really well. But I share in the intro of my book. The thing that I struggled with is, okay, I'm doing all this great work, high priority and high profile projects liked by my peers, but why can't I move from this middle level into senior management? And so I pushed, I pushed, I pushed. I didn't know what to do and it wasn't working for me. And it wasn't until I left LinkedIn to go to Prezi, where I had that mindset shift. I talked to a lot of people, try to figure out what went wrong or, what did I do wrong. And I realized that I wasn't advocating for myself in the best way. I wasn't being strategic. Right. I was doing what I was told. I was very deferential but not being proactive, like, oh, I see an opportunity here or I'm going to raise my hand to do this. And so, I feel like it was after those formative years that I really kind of grew my confidence a lot more and became a lot more thoughtful about my career and had more of an intentional direction. I love that. I love the transparency here. And you know, if, the Lorraine from this period, if, she could see you today, what do you think she'd say? Oh my gosh. I, you had asked me before, did I imagine I'd end up here? And like, absolutely not. Like, just not even at all. And so I think she would be really shocked and be like, oh my gosh, like you're speaking now and you know, you're, you know, I'm a little bit shy and introverted. Like, oh, My gosh, you're, you're speaking to companies and in front of audiences and you're writing a book. And I think she would just be in shock. Yeah, sometimes I'm still in shock. Today I'm like, wow, I'm doing this thing okay. Yeah. Oh my gosh, I can imagine. I love that. So listen, we. Speaking of speaking, right? Yeah, speaking of Speaking, you started 2021, you know, openly nervous about public speaking, and now you're a best selling author. So keynote speaker, LinkedIn, top voice, all of that stuff. Tell us about what clicked for you in that mindset shift that you were talking about earlier that moved you from fear to fuel at the start of 2021. I came up with this personal goal for myself to become better at public speaking. I was working at Prezi, which is a presentation company. I had this colleague who I had seen doing public speaking and recording videos, and I was like, wow, he. I, mean, that's a. He just looks great. It's like such. He seems more credible. He is really impressing me. Like, I want to be like that. And I'm working at a presentation company. It feels like a good goal for myself. So I didn't seek out trying to become a professional speaker. It was a personal goal that sort of evolved and became its own thing. But I think it's such an important skill to be able to get comfortable speaking in front of groups, to share, your expertise right out into the world. And the thing is, is that, yes, I was very nervous back then. I still get nervous now, and I think we always will have nerves. It's just a biological thing in us. The thing now that's different from before is I have a much better understanding of why those nerves happen, and I have much better control over those nerves so that I make them more focused. They keep me attentive. They keep me focused in the moment versus, oh, my gosh, they're getting in my head and my thoughts scrambled, and I can't remember what I want to say. Yeah, no, I hear that. I think that's so, beautiful. The, When you saw that colleague and all that he could do and how he was presenting, something ignited in you. And I think this is a very important point to my dear listener right now. When these examples come in front of you, some people call them breadcrumbs. They're showing you what's possible. Yeah. I often see classic responses, which is natural, by the way. You know, jealousy, like, oh, you know. But you chose inspiration. We have a choice, and jealousy kind of keeps us stuck where we are. But I read somewhere, isn't jealousy, you know, trapped desire, like it wants to. Wants to do things right? And you were like, whoa, you know, this is a template. I like this. Something is igniting in me. I don't know how this scares me. Maybe I'll figure it out. And you did. You did, right? So now I want to fast forward, because one year later, we talk about 2021 and 2022 plot twist, which is what I love about all my guests. Right. It's not always hunky dory. And look how successful she is. And she must be so lucky. And it comes easily to her. It's never like that. Those are not stories. Those are like a linear flat line that goes nowhere. Plot twist. In 2022, you get laid off. Yeah. Yet you come back stronger by launching your own company. And so many of us are thinking about doing that, but we have so much fear. We have so much fear around that. So what did you learn in that moment, you know, that changed the way how you show up professionally? And I'd also like to stay here and ask you, more about, like, how you got hired. Because that's our theme here, how you got hired for your first paid speaking gig. Because in the beginning people are like, hey, I'll work for free. And we all do that. But, you know, at the end of the day in our business, if we don't have sales, it's like oxygen, right? How, how do we survive? So I'd love to hear more about that journey. Being laid off in 2022 and getting the wheels in motion. I'll actually switch the order of those because it actually, my first paid, check for speaking actually came before the layoff, which I think helped me thrive after the layoff. So what happened was a, company reached out. I had started speaking more, as I said, in 2021. And so I'd done a lot of virtual panels and, speaking events and webinars and this and that. And by the time, I can't remember if it was late 2021 or sometime, you know, early mid-2022, but a reached out to me and they needed a virtual speaker out of the blue. Yeah, they, they found me because I started posting more on LinkedIn and building my brand and staying top of mind. And so they reached out and they let me know what their budget was. And I was like, oh, my gosh, like, I can get paid for this now. Like, this is crazy. And so that getting paid, like, outside of my day job was a very important switch in to help me grow my confidence. Like, wow, okay, I'm at a level where people are willing to pay me and where you get that confidence, like, oh, I can make money outside of a corporation. Like, I think that's a very powerful thing to know. Even if you stay in corporate. Like, it's great to know that you can do that and create means for yourself if you need to. So that happened and then the layoff happened at the end of 2022. And I was part of tech when it was, you know, at its height, it's golden years. And so I'd never gone through a layoff. Before, even though so many of peers in other industries had. And it was quite a shock. I mean, I woke up one morning, I had the calendar invite. I just wrote an article about this in Business Insider, if anyone wants to dig deeper. But I woke up one morning, I was like, your, your conversation, what's this about? And. And then realized, oh, my gosh, this is my layoff. And I was in a bit of shock at first, and then I, you know, got to my computer, started downloading everything, that I needed, and. And then I was at this crossroads. Do I want to apply for another job? Or maybe. Everyone kept asking me, would you ever do your own thing? And I used to say, no, I don't want to. It's much more stable in corporate. But ultimately decided to start my own thing. I had seen enough signals. I'd also become a LinkedIn learning instructor while at Prezi. Had seen enough signals that maybe this could be something. Also, the job market was crazy at that time, and I was like, I don't want to. I don't want to step into that. Wow. And I love that you were already, speaking, in a paid professional capacity while you still had your day job. Right. And that's the power of putting your voice out there. Let, this be the signal to the person who's listening. It's never too late to start. Start today. And how did that momentum, like, keep you moving? You know, getting the second gig, third gig? Did everything just kind of fall in your lap? And every month is fantastic. People say, I, I, I, made what I made in one year. I made that in six months. All of these stories, which I haven't. Sometimes there's so much BS out there, so, you know, it's not always true. Right? It can be rough. No, absolutely not. No, absolutely not. So what was that like in the beginning? Oh, my gosh. It was such a grind. It's still a grind, Right. I'm going into year three. It's so much work. It's not like, you know, people are knocking at my door all the time. The people are at my door, and also, I have to go out and knock on other people's doors. We assume people are going to be knocking and breaking our door down and throwing their credit card at us. It doesn't always work that way. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. No, it's crazy. It's, it's. It's such a grind, such a hustle. It's. You have to feel comfortable reaching out to your network, I think, especially when you start off like those are going to be your initial clients and the people who are willing to make the introductions that you need. So especially for me as a speaker, it would be going to my friends in tech and saying, hey, do you have a need for this? Like, are there any groups that bring in speakers that you could introduce me to? So it's, it's a lot. Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's non stop. I have since made, you know, my, my, my tech salary, but it wasn't in six months, certainly. And also these things like ebb and flow and I'm also working harder than I did in my corporate job. So to your point, so like on LinkedIn, we see all these, yeah, I need six figures in a month, in my first month, and this and that. But I mean, I think that's just posturing for social media. Posturing. There are no receipts. And and secondly, this sounds a bit cynical, but I still have to say it. We often leave our nine to five only to work 24 7. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, when you work for yourself, it's not like you have a hundred people that you can, you know, outsource things to. Exactly. You still have to show up. You got to put in the work. You're the face. So this is a very important point because there's a lot of glamour associated with entrepreneurship and it's not always the first thing we need to jump towards. It is a, you know, still a little bit of a risk because we have to see what is our, what is the word? Our appetite, our appetite for risk. What is our cushion? Because we have some savings or we may not have savings. Right. So I totally get that. And you know, now let's talk about, like, we're going to talk about the book in a minute, but I want to hear also about. You have certain thoughts about presence, influence, communication. And you're teaching all these things to people from like, you know, whether they're Stanford students or Fortune 100 executives. In your experience, Lorraine, what's the one very common mistake that you see even smart professionals make when they are trying to be in air quotes, seen. The way I define presence generally and also in the book is professional presence is both how and where you are seen. And I think when a lot of us hear presence, we think, oh, executive presence. How I show up in the room, the boardroom I'm at a certain level, I'm presenting to a team of executives. But I think presence has become so Much more than that. And so executive presence is one piece of the puzzle, but presence is also our LinkedIn presence, our virtual and video presence, which Slack channels we're showing up in. And so you mentioned the where piece. Like, I think that's where a lot of people miss the mark is we work really hard, we have a great reputation, we are focused on the how, how others see us, but we're not focused as much on the where and making sure that we're not just being seen in a really positive light by our immediate team, but rather executives, cross functional stakeholders, whoever's going to be in the promotion discussions. Right. On camera on LinkedIn, we need to be more intentional about the where piece and where we're showing up so that we're being seen by the right people in the right places. And what would you like? Let's double click on that. When you say where, what does one need, to do more of or less of when we talk about presence? I'll touch on two points there. So virtual presence, because I know you have all this in the book and I do recommend to the reader to get to the listener to get a copy, but we want a little bit of a taste. So we, you know. Sure, sure. Yeah, yeah. You asked me before about common, mistakes. I see. I think virtual presence is a really big missed opportunity. And I'll, talk about virtual presence and people are like, oh, you know, we, you know, it's been many years. Like, we're all good on video now. And then you get on calls and you're like, they're in a dark room. They don't have the right framing, they don't have a nice curated background. And those things, you know, it's not maybe as obvious, but subconsciously, like, people are forming an impression of you. And also when you're not in a great setup, like, it doesn't do anything for your confidence. When you have a really great setup, when you know that you're showing up well on camera, it's a huge confidence boost and, and other people can see that and they will form a more positive impression of you. Now, especially when we are in our virtual distributed hybrid workplaces, video is going to be one of the main ways that we communicate and so we need to know how to show up for that. The second piece, and you touched on this earlier, is LinkedIn. And I think LinkedIn is one of the most important places to be on. I always call it, our virtual landing page, our virtual, water cooler, and really our ultimate virtual office. So you want to make sure that you have a strong presence on there. So that, let's say I meet you in person, and you think really highly of me, and you go to my LinkedIn and half of it is missing. Yeah. It's like, Is she as impressive as I thought? Like, kind of a disconnect there. And same thing can go vice versa. Right. Like, lots of people before meeting me will be like, wow, you have a really strong LinkedIn presence. So now they're primed already to think positively of me and they're excited to meet me. And then when we talk, you know, hopefully it continues and you make that positive impression. But it really goes so far. Yeah, for sure, for sure. And I think that cohesiveness between how you show up on LinkedIn and how you show up in your real life, you want to make sure both are elevated at your best. And not like one is average or mediocre. It's not worth it. Right. Because we don't often get a second chance to make a first impression. And your book, Unforgettable Presence, okay. It's packed with practical advice for standing out at work without being loud, without being inauthentic. So I'm wondering, you know, what inspired you to write it? Maybe, I'm guessing because you talked earlier about your previous experience. I wish I'd had this knowledge, etc. But tell us more about, what made you get started? And also a myth, mith. A myth about executive presence that right now, Lorraine, you just want to bust wide open. I got the idea to write the book from a former coworker, actually my slideshare coworker. So very start of my career. He saw, Arun saw that I, had published my first LinkedIn learning course. And he congratulated me and he was like, when's the book coming out? And I'm so thankful for him because sometimes we need those mentors, those friends who sort of see something in us before we see it in ourselves. And so that really planted the seed. I was like, oh, okay, maybe that's something I should think about at some point. And so it was always in the back of my head. When I started my business, I did this self publishing cohort thinking, okay, you know, I don't have a lot of clients coming in right now. Let me sort of just take the time. But pretty soon business got busy. And also I realized how hard it is to write a book. I was like, I don't even know what this book would be about right now. And it wasn't until a year later where a few different publishers reached out to me on LinkedIn. They had seen me posting there and I just took it as a sign from the universe, like, this is my time to write this book. Maybe I don't feel 100% ready, but I want to capture this opportunity. And so, yeah, it started from that, that idea from my former co, worker. And then, and then as I started writing the proposal, it came to me a lot easier, like, what is the message behind this book? And, and we, we touched on it a little bit earlier. But a lot of the books out there around Presence are focused on executive presence and our focus on the in person experience. And my career and expertise had really taken off in the virtual space. So for me, I feel like that's a key part of the book and something that I want people to realize is really important. And also that presence is not just for executives. It's something we should be thinking about at every point in our career, at every moment, every stage. I'm so glad you said that, because when we hear presence, it's like twins. We always hear them together. Executive presence, executive presence. I am sick and tired of hearing that. And I'm so glad you said it's time to divorce that term because presence is not the monopoly of executives. Damn it. This is so important because, not just what you just said, but also how this book happened. Because someone listening right now has an idea, has a spark for a book. Our biggest, fear factor at this point, Lorraine, for most of us is like, what's the point? Number one, there's so many books already out there on this topic. Number two, are people really reading as much? Don't know. I feel like everyone's distracted with streaming and people's attention spans are 3, 4 minutes. Did you have any of those doubts? There's so many authors already published who, who are, you know, best selling, authors, which, by the way, you are. So congrats. We were just talking about that backstage because I know this is a grind to make this happen, but, I know it's different for you because the publishers reached out to you, which is amazing. I love that. But you know, that whole, like, what's the point? Because there's a lot already out there on this topic. What's your thoughts on that? Oh my gosh, so much imposter syndrome with this book. I don't think I. There hasn't been in my career. I think that I've had this Much imposter syndrome. And I'm like, normally a fairly confident person, but there's just those moments where you're like, has this already been said before? Like, do people, Is this old news? Like, is this interesting enough for people? And you just have all these doubts that come into your head. Yeah, 100%. How did you, what is the. Overcome it Overcome or how did you continue? Regardless, I think you have to, I mean, part of it's like you, you, you agree to do this thing and you want to see it through. Part of it is talking to those mentors or peers or coaches who are like, no, like, people need to see this in the world. I have this book coach, and she says this thing, that it's like selfish to hold this knowledge to yourself and people need your help and you've helped so many people before, so why would this book be any different? And it's like a reframing where it doesn't have to be every single unique idea in the world in this book, but you're packaging it in a way and you're providing frameworks in a way in one place that make it easy for people to learn from you and to continue creating their unforgettable presence so it doesn't ever, I don't think, truly go away, but you have to just not let those, those voices take over. And turning to people in your network, I think can be a helpful way. Yeah, for sure. Beautiful. We've come to the end, Lorraine. It's gone really fast. And I have this particular question I ask every single guest of mine. When you look back on your career, Lorraine, is there one standout defining moment or not that supercharged your career and helped you to move closer to your current success? I think taking on that goal to get comfortable public speaking, I, I feel like that 2021. Yeah, 2021, it really kick started everything. It helped grow my confidence, it helped build my visibility on LinkedIn. It led to the LinkedIn learning courses, the book. You know, it's just, I think that was the big thing and that's why I get so passionate telling people like, I know it's scary, but it'll get easier and you have to just keep practicing. And it's just, it's such an important skill, valuable skill. So when I think back, I think that was, that was probably one of the major ones. Yeah, the 0 to 1 is always harder and it gets easier. 1 to 2, 2 to 3, for sure. Beautiful. And Lorraine, what's the best way for people to learn more about you and how can we get our grubby little hands on the book, of course. So you can find me on LinkedIn. My, handle is Lorraine K Lee. And then also visit unforgettable presencebook.com to grab your copy and then, upload your receipt as well to get some bonus goodies. Oh, beautiful. So unforgettable presence. B E B R E S E N c e unforgettable presence book.com unforgettable presencebook.com I'm going to put all this in the show notes, but just in case someone's listening right now and wants to get their copy right now. Why, make them wait as well as follow loren on, LinkedIn. Her handle is Lorraine K Lee. L E E. To make sure you follow her. Lorraine, this has been such a pleasure. I wish you continued success with the business, with the book and beyond. Thank you so much for your time and generosity with us today. Thank you for having me. This is really fun.